Alfa Pages

[tempra2]

Has anybody done this? I can't find any kits available from (E.g) Goodridge. The fronts will be the same as the normal 16v I guess; but what about the rears?

[tvatavuk]

As I said earlier, yes fronts are same as on 16v.
Rear well:
- 16v one pair of rear rubber hoses
- P4 has that same par but almost half lenght of 16v rear ones
+ there is also one pair (around same lenght as 16v rear ones) that connects steel pipes from chasis to steel pipes on rear differential.

In Croatia Goodridge dealer cuts rubber/flexible braided hoses and inserts end connectors when you order hoses in shop. So only problem you might have here is that seller doesn't have right connector for hoses you need or connector that wasn't fitted correctly and preasure tested
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Tino Vatavuk
Little black dress which replaced Alfa Romeo 33 S 16v Permanent 4 GMo

[tempra2]

Thanks Tino - so the P4 has 6 hoses and the Normal 16v's have only four?

The only place I can find that'll do custom braided hoses in the UK are mail order, but I don't know the types and dimensions of the fittings to be able to place an order sadly.
I guess the other alternative would be to remove all the hoses and send to them for matching, but I don't fancy this much as I fear the air intoduced into the system whilst waiting for the parts will make it's way to the master cylinder

[tempra2]

I think that I've found a Goodridge kit:
33 (1.7 16v P4 & 4x4) & 33S (ABS) Part Number SAR0460-6
From here: http://www.goodridge.co.uk/buy-goodridge-hoses.php?mk=5

I'm reading the above description as saying it'll fit:
33P4 and
33S which must mean a P2 with ABS and hence rear discs

I think this logic makes sense so I've ordered a set - fingers crossed!

[tvatavuk]

From what I can see in part numbers last digit should be number of needed hoses 3-4 for normal 33s, 6 for P4.
Price is also higher then normal meaning that must be it.
Originaly all P4 were ABS equiped but that ABS was forbiden in UK so there are some slight differences in EU and UK P4 brakes. Still I wouldn't expect hoses and endings to be different.
Make a photo when package arrives

Cheers
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Tino Vatavuk
Little black dress which replaced Alfa Romeo 33 S 16v Permanent 4 GMo

[RFlower]

Are you guys aware of possible problems of failure of Teflon hoses due to flexing and/or low temperature?

The following extract is from http://www.dimebank.com/BrakePlumbing.html

A few words about Teflon lines: they may not have a place on your street car. For starters, the Teflon lines you make up at home don't have DOT approval, because they haven't been through the DOT approval process and you're not a certified manufacturer. Even the Teflon lines you can buy pre-built are probably not DOT approved (though there are a few coming onto the market) for the same certification reasons. The main reason for this lack of approval is that manufacturers of racing gear don't care to spend the money - they're building the hoses for racers. The next reason is that the DOT expected lifetime for such brake hoses is five years, and the prudent racer will replace his or her brake hoses every other season, just to be sure. (This is a good reason to make your own - then you can reuse the fittings and just buy new olives and hose.) There are some concerns about using Teflon line in cold environments, though Aircraft Spruce is willing to sell you lines custom made from Aeroquip Teflon hose and rate them to -40 degF, so I'm not so sure that's a concern. It may well be that the intended application for those lines is not subject to as much repeated deflection as the flex line snaking through your front suspension out to the caliper.

The fact that the lines are not approved could be an issue in the event of an accident due to brake failure.

I know I am having second thoughts about them, as the braiding means that the hose itself cannot be inspected.
_________________
Dick Flower, Nr. Carcassonne. '94 Trofeo 1.4 ie (F), '93 Imola 1.3/1.4 ie (now for breaking) (F), '91 1.7 ie (GB)(spare car), '86 Sprint 1.5 QV (F). '87 VW Syncro camper (F), '73 NSU Ro80 (F), '99 Fiat Seicento (F)

[tempra2]

Hi,

Yeah I read all that on the research I did before parting with my hard earned!
To be absolutely clear - I'm not talking about making up my own hoses! These are from Goodridge and are supplied ready to fit.
My understanding is DOT is an American thing and the way the wording is written on the standard makes aftermarket hoses impossible to approve. I live in the UK.

The main reported cause of failure on these lines appears to be from dirt ingress through the braid, this then rubs against the teflon inner and causes failure. The reputable manufacturers have been coating the braid with a clear plastic for a long time now to prevent this from happening.
A lot of cheaper kits also fail at the unions as they are, er, cheap!
Another problem appears to be chafing causing failure so I've sourced some spiralbind to protect the hoses. Take your point about not being able to inspect them properly though.

There's a long and somewhat boring discussion about it here:
http://www.pistonheads.co.uk/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&f=23&t=363280


I think the verdit is that it's pretty much down to personal preference! I've fitted them to numerous cars and bikes and feel they've made a difference, and I need all the help I can get with the 33's piss poor brakes TBH. I've got to replace the brake hoses anyway as they look original (15 years old) and I don't think (But haven't checked) that P4 original are available any more

[tvatavuk]

2 tempra Don't know if you seen or not but 2 year old topic but good topic about problems on braided hoses.
http://www.alfa-pages.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=2492&highlight=hoses

2Rflower you still have those braided hoses on sprint?
_________________
Tino Vatavuk
Little black dress which replaced Alfa Romeo 33 S 16v Permanent 4 GMo

[RFlower]

Tino - yes, the hoses are still on the Sprint, but it's still off the road. We haven't used it since I bought the 33, which is handier and more economical etc., and I can't afford to insure all our cars. And I bought the 33 to put the engine in the Sprint!
_________________
Dick Flower, Nr. Carcassonne. '94 Trofeo 1.4 ie (F), '93 Imola 1.3/1.4 ie (now for breaking) (F), '91 1.7 ie (GB)(spare car), '86 Sprint 1.5 QV (F). '87 VW Syncro camper (F), '73 NSU Ro80 (F), '99 Fiat Seicento (F)

[Admin]

Hi

From a bike, but this is the effects of a braided line rubbing:-

http://www.alfa-pages.co.uk/TempPicture/colsbrake.jpg

Doesn't take that long. Seem more prone to this damage that rubber hoses.

All the best

Keith