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rsfruitbat Alfa Sprint
Joined: 13 Jun 2007 Posts: 241 Location: Kidderminster
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Posted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 6:36 am Post subject: sump baffles |
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Bought a fantastic sump for my car only to find problems installing with manifold mods I made. Anyone have any suggestions on baffling a std sump for a 16V as an interim measure?
Suspect I will go for a bespoke manifold or make it myself. Anyone reccommend any companies?
rsfruitbat _________________ Alfa 33 rallycar series 1
1399cc 16V
red / white / blue |
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Rich B Alfa 33
Joined: 19 May 2003 Posts: 386 Location: Southampton
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Posted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 11:57 am Post subject: |
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Try Brunswick motorsport (www.brunswickracing.co.uk) 01353 668840 - speak to Giles. They do all kinds of stuff for 33s as they build race engines and I'm pretty sure they'll make you a baffled sump
Hope that helps
Good luck
Rich |
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Eddie_W Alfasud
Joined: 08 Aug 2007 Posts: 74 Location: New Zealand
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Posted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 11:24 am Post subject: |
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Does the 16v sump differ much in configeration from the 8v? The 8v sump has quite a large part of the surge tray cut out to allow easier fitting around the pickup. Unnecessarily so in my opinion and I would definitely want to improve that if I was trackdaying. When I finally get around to building my good motor I will wing the sump with swinging gate baffles as I did for my friends tarmac rally car. Any openings in the surge tray should have a lip sticking down of at least 25mm to prevent oil migrating along the underside of the tray and out the hole under hard cornering.
Regards Eddie _________________ The pop star formerly known as Eddie W |
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richard33 Alfasud
Joined: 29 Jun 2005 Posts: 40 Location: Somerset, UK
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Posted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 5:35 pm Post subject: |
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Eddie_W wrote: |
Any openings in the surge tray should have a lip sticking down of at least 25mm to prevent oil migrating along the underside of the tray and out the hole under hard cornering.
Regards Eddie |
This is exactly what I did to the sump on my 16v race engine. I spoke to both Bianco and Adie Hawkins and this is what they do. I simply made up a strip of thin steel - with a cutout for the oil pick-up pipe - and welded it around the edge of the surge tray. I made up a dummy first using a spare sump, so I could achieve the optimum clearances. I had a winged sump on one of my previous 8v racers - it was excellent, but it made it almost impossible to remove the sump with the engine in the car.
I must have my 'dummy' sump somewhere, so if you're stuck let me know and you can have it. |
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rsfruitbat Alfa Sprint
Joined: 13 Jun 2007 Posts: 241 Location: Kidderminster
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Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 1:34 pm Post subject: |
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What I wasnt sure about was the oil feeds from the heads. I have welded the strip off the edge of the surge plate down to the bottom of the sump previously and that was the design I have used historically. I just used to leave a quarter inch gap along the bottom.
However on this wonderful new sump that doesnt fit there are some extension pipes that feed the return oil back into the centre section where the pickup pipe is. I presume if you dont do this it is feeding the oil to the wrong side of the baffle and not onto the pick up pipe?.
On the 8V engine the return is above the sump line so all the oil flows down the surge plate and is fed around the pickup foot which is then retained to a degree by the extension.
rsfruitbat _________________ Alfa 33 rallycar series 1
1399cc 16V
red / white / blue |
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richard33 Alfasud
Joined: 29 Jun 2005 Posts: 40 Location: Somerset, UK
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Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 2:21 pm Post subject: |
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You've just reminded me of another tweek I did - as suggested by the lads at Bianco. They reckoned that under hard cornering the oil could shoot back up head drain pipe. I welded a half moon restricter in place to prevent this.Whether it does anygood, I don't know - but as the drain pipe seems overly large, it can't do any harm.
You say that your 'super sump' has a return above the baffle, so I would think that this is a better arrangement and that a problem is unlikely. |
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rsfruitbat Alfa Sprint
Joined: 13 Jun 2007 Posts: 241 Location: Kidderminster
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Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 5:27 pm Post subject: |
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I will try and take some pics of what I am on about. It should make it a lot easier. You know what they say, if a picture paints a thousand words....
rsfruitbat _________________ Alfa 33 rallycar series 1
1399cc 16V
red / white / blue |
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knighty Alfasud
Joined: 12 Oct 2004 Posts: 33 Location: Essex, UK
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Posted: Mon Oct 13, 2008 4:40 pm Post subject: |
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is this any help?.........some I did a few years back........one thing to bear in mind which is not included in the drawings........you need about 5mm clearance under all the vertical baffle edges.
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rsfruitbat Alfa Sprint
Joined: 13 Jun 2007 Posts: 241 Location: Kidderminster
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Posted: Sat Oct 18, 2008 6:01 pm Post subject: |
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Thats a big help thanks. your design is very similar to the one that I bought .
Many thanks for putting up the sketches
rsfruitbat _________________ Alfa 33 rallycar series 1
1399cc 16V
red / white / blue |
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