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bobbber · Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 10:18 am Post subject: Hydraulic Tappets

I've finally decided I've had enough of those 8 hydraulic tappets clicking away all day!

What I'm planning :

1. Drain coolant and oil.
2. Remove radiator and front bumper.
3. Remove cambelt covers.
4. Mark crank and cambelt positions.
5. Un-tension cambelts, and remove.
6. Remove cam covers each side of car.
7. Remove tappets and restore/replace as necessary.

Can this be done like this? With the engine in the car? Do I need to delve another level deep into the engine each side (i.e. remove the manifold and exhaust connections to remove the next stage in the block?)

Any ideas?

Thanks!

Bob
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Fiat Bravo 165 Sport

gritsop · Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 12:36 pm Post subject:

Hi Bob,

You can remove the front crossmember which will give you better access to the heads.

By the way you have to remove the cylinder heads (held in place by 6 screws) in order to take out the cam covers. This means thay you have to machine the heads and why not do some valve work while everything's out.

Regards,
_________________
Thanassis Gritsopoulos
1991 Alfa 33 1.4 IE
2001 Alfa 147 1.6 Distinctive

http://www.alfa-restoration.co.uk
Parts Shop: www.alfa-restoration.co.uk/shop

bobbber · Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 1:41 pm Post subject:

Why not Than? Because I'm SCARED, that's why!

It's really annoying, because the original Hrska design allowed the solid lifters to be adjusted 'through' the camshaft, without removing it!

Anyway - I digress.

I know this diagram is from a Series I (so i'ts slightly different, but ok for this purpose) :

I'll need to take off part 26 - I know that. But to remove the hydraulic lifters, will I need to remove 14 also?

Thanks!

Bob

P.S. I got your hinge article - it's BRILLIANT!
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Fiat Bravo 165 Sport

gritsop · Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 1:59 pm Post subject:

Bob read the article and you 'll see what I mean. You have to take out the heads ... there is no alternate way to reach the tappets.

Regards,
_________________
Thanassis Gritsopoulos
1991 Alfa 33 1.4 IE
2001 Alfa 147 1.6 Distinctive

http://www.alfa-restoration.co.uk
Parts Shop: www.alfa-restoration.co.uk/shop

bobbber · Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 2:06 pm Post subject:

Oh fooey!

Gonna have to take extra time off work to get that one done then! Out come the injectors - and the fuel rail - and the manifolds!!!!!

Crying or Very sad

gonna just sit here now.

(thanks mate).

Bob
_________________
Fiat Bravo 165 Sport

Ben_nz · Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 8:34 pm Post subject:

Is it possible to do this without moving the engine at all? I think I heard the head bolts were too long and couldn't be removed because they hit the wheel arches or something.

I've always wanted to be able to do a job like this (and to install some mild cams etc while I'm at it), but it sounds beyond my ability to do in my driveway.

bobbber · Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 11:16 pm Post subject:

Maybe we should pick a day (night) and both change the tappets (cams) at the same time... and keep in touch via ICQ?!?!?! Laughing

Bob
_________________
Fiat Bravo 165 Sport

Ben_nz · Posted: Thu Oct 13, 2005 9:46 am Post subject:

Pick a day? More like pick several weekends. And there'd be a lot of research and parts/tools purchasing beforehand, assuming the job's even possible without a hoist or engine crane.

What's the best that could happen?
Engine goes again, slightly better and less rattly.

What's the worst that could happen?
Petrol from the carbs spills on me and ignites.
Engine wrongly reassembled and bends all valves when first cranked over.
Engine poorly reassembled and blows up on the motorway, sending me off the road at 100kph.. Wink

bobbber · Posted: Thu Oct 13, 2005 10:14 am Post subject:

We could broadcast it on the web!

The WORLDS first interactive hydraulic lifter changes - on both sides of the world! Laughing

I think people would keep typing in : 'Nope, you're doing that wrong'... 'don't DO THAT!'... etc Laughing

It MUST be possible with the engine in the car, or Thanassis wouldn't recommend removal of the crossmember!?!?!?

Bob
_________________
Fiat Bravo 165 Sport

gritsop · Posted: Thu Oct 13, 2005 4:07 pm Post subject:

Yes, taking the heads off the engine can be done with the motor on the car.

That's why I mentioned to take out the crossmember; it will be easier to work on.

Regards
_________________
Thanassis Gritsopoulos
1991 Alfa 33 1.4 IE
2001 Alfa 147 1.6 Distinctive

http://www.alfa-restoration.co.uk
Parts Shop: www.alfa-restoration.co.uk/shop

Ben_nz · Posted: Fri Oct 14, 2005 10:11 am Post subject:

I just confirmed with my Haynes manual that it is possible to remove the cylinder heads with the engine in the car.
You can't take the head bolts out completely before removing the heads because there isn't room. Smile

In order to get the heads out, you have to remove:
battery earth connection
coolant
spark plugs
air cleaner
intake manifold
carburettors
exhaust manifold
alternator and drive belt
cambelt covers and cambelts

That list doesn't include the radiator ("desirable but not essential"), the front crossmember or even the engine oil. Although it does refer to the solid lifter motors where you can open the camshaft housing covers and syringe oil out beforehand.
And fortunately for us, installation is apparently the reverse of removal! Very Happy

bobbber · Posted: Fri Oct 14, 2005 10:15 am Post subject:

I'm gonna do it!!!!

Just need to pick a weekend when I've nothing on Rolling Eyes

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Fiat Bravo 165 Sport

bobbber · Posted: Fri Oct 14, 2005 11:34 am Post subject:

I thought this was a good article (for the Vauxhall Astra) but probably VERY similar :

http://16vastra.usererror.org.uk/lifters.htm

There's an extra step for us injection owners - as the inlet manifold has another section with the injectors in. So the injectors and fuel rail need to come out!

Any other tips? Before I start stripping it down?????

I'm going to do a day of preparation first:

Check the exhaust can be removed without snapping the pins

Check the injectors and fuel rail can be removed

I'm gonna do this to check there is nothing stopping the smooth operation, when I actually come to do the job. Very Happy

Bob
_________________
Fiat Bravo 165 Sport

Edward · Alfa 33 Joined: 21 Sep 2003 Posts: 307 Location: Bristol

Bob,

Just a word of caution - I tried to get the heads off easily on a 8 valve with injection recently, pretty difficult. All I wanted was the cams out of a car going for scrap. On this engine with the cam enclosures facing the engine there was no room to get the last two bolts out on each side with the body in the way. We tried to lift the engine on a jack whist jumping up and down on the other side to (tilt the engine) create enough space to get the bolts out - no! Ended up cutting through the bolts with a grinder. Got the cams in the end though.
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The faster the better.

Ben_nz · Posted: Mon Oct 17, 2005 8:09 am Post subject:

That must be what I remember hearing.
According to Haynes you don't need to take the bolts all the way out - just undo them from the block then remove the heads and cam enclosures as one unit. You can take the bolts out once the whole lot's out of the car.
Would that have worked?

Edit: The part of the Haynes manual which says this is possible is the supplement covering the Alfa Sprint. Perhaps it has more room either side of the engine than a 33 does.

bobbber · Posted: Mon Oct 17, 2005 1:54 pm Post subject:

Not helping!!!! Even more scared now!!!! Laughing

Bob
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Fiat Bravo 165 Sport